Stella Tarica

Tanzer: Would you introduce yourself, Stella?
TARICA: Yes. Stella Varon Tarica.

Tanzer: Where were you born?
TARICA: In the island of Rhodes.

Tanzer: When?
TARICA: 1931.

Tanzer: Tell me about your family. How large was it, and what did your father do?
TARICA: We come from four, two brothers and two sisters, my father and mother. My dad worked in a big department store in the island of Rhodes.

Tanzer: What was the Jewish community of Rhodes like?
TARICA: A very close one. We lived close, more or less like in a ghetto.

Tanzer: Was it a Sephardic community?
TARICA: Yes, it was a Sephardic community. I think all of it was Sephardic.

Tanzer: Was it an Orthodox community?
TARICA: Yes.

Tanzer: What type of education did you receive?
TARICA: Grade school and junior high, and then I was deported. We were arrested by the Germans.

Tanzer: How old were you at that time?
TARICA: I was 14.

Tanzer: Did you or your family belong to any religious or political groups at that time?
TARICA: No.

Tanzer: You were not a member of any religious group?
TARICA: The only religious group was our synagogue, members of our synagogue congregation.

Tanzer: How active was your family in the synagogue?
TARICA: Not very active. They weren’t active at all, just members. We attended the services regularly, but that was it then.

Tanzer: What do you remember about the climate on Rhodes before the war, the political and social climate?
TARICA: I remember very little, really. Everything was hush-hush. Nothing was open because of being persecuted. There was always that fear.

Tanzer: What was the persecution like?
TARICA: Just mistreated. I was pretty young; I don’t remember. But I do remember being persecuted, and they made us feel bad to be Jewish.

Tanzer: Did you know why you were being persecuted and mistreated?
TARICA: No.

Tanzer: What do you remember about the deportation?
TARICA: Terrible things. Unhappy things.

Tanzer: Can you tell me about the preparations for the deportation?
TARICA: We were separated, the families, the men and the women. They put some notice in the streets that all the men needed to be at work for the Germans, but we didn’t know what was coming next. Then all the men were arrested. Then they told us if the women didn’t come to a place, to a center of the city, then the men were going to be killed. So we just left everything, all the personal belongings, homes, and everything. We took a little bit with us, whatever we could.

Tanzer: Did you know that you were going to be sent away at that time?
TARICA: No, we didn’t know that. We were told where all the women were to go. We were all the Jewish families together in one area of the city again, where they told us to go. We were surrounded by the Germans with the guns. We didn’t know what was coming to us, what was happening. We thought we were going to be put in a camp on the island and stay there and work. But it wasn’t that way.

Tanzer: How did they move you off the island?
TARICA: They put us in cargo ships. It was just like a bad dream altogether. We couldn’t believe it, what was happening.

Tanzer: You were with your family?
TARICA: We were together, yes.

Tanzer: Was your father with you then?
TARICA: Yes, we were all together. They put us in cargo ships, and they took us to Athens, Greece. After that, we were put in a big building and they searched us completely, one by one, took all the personal belongings, rings, any gold, anything that we had. They took everything from us. Then they put us in cargo — what do you call those trains?

Tanzer: Transports.
TARICA: Where they put cows, all closed. They filled us like sardines, and we were deported, for weeks and weeks in those trains.

Tanzer: How long were you in Athens?
TARICA: We were there two or three days, I think.

Tanzer: In a building.
TARICA: Yes, in a big building, just waiting for what was going to happen next.

Tanzer: Do you remember anything particular about the trip to the camp?
TARICA: It was miserable, just terrible.

Tanzer: Were you in the same car as with your family?
TARICA: Yes, we were together. We didn’t know what was happening to us. They would stop maybe once or twice a day for a few minutes and open the door just a little bit, for air. I don’t remember feeding us or anything like that. It was terrible.

Tanzer: Had you been able to bring any food along with you on the transports?
TARICA: No. We weren’t aware of what was happening to us; we weren’t prepared for it. It was so sudden and so fast. Nothing was prepared for it. It seemed like weeks to be on that train, traveling all the cities.

Tanzer: Were you aware where you were going?
TARICA: No. They told us they were going to take us to a camp and everybody was going to be together as families, working together. We were sad and miserable and worried what was going to happen to us, but at least we thought we were going to be together as families with the parents and children. We felt a little relief that at least we were going to stay together. But they never told us what was going to happen.

Tanzer: You say “they.” Who was telling you?
TARICA: The Germans.

Tanzer: Did they communicate with you?
TARICA: No, they didn’t. There was an interpreter, but there was very little said to us.

Tanzer: What do you remember about the arrival at the camp?
TARICA: That was terrible. It was really bad. We were put in line. We didn’t know where we were. Anyway, I didn’t know where I was. I’m sure everybody didn’t know, because we were locked in those cattle trains. Nobody knew what was happening to us. We were in line. We were separated, the men and the women, the young and the old. An officer came and he separated us again, whoever he wanted to put aside.

Tanzer: Were you able to remain with your family?
TARICA: No, I was separated from them. Then we can see from far away, from a distance, the cabins, the people there that were in and out. They just looked — it was hard to believe.

Tanzer: Then in the processing, were you sent to the cabins?
TARICA: It was a long thing. It was a whole day and night. We were put in a big, empty building. They shaved us all the hair. They took everything, all the clothes completely, completely nude, and they gave us some of their clothing, just a piece of rag. No shoes, no nothing. No underwear, no nothing. We were assigned to cabins.

Tanzer: How did they communicate with you?
TARICA: There was no communication at all. We couldn’t understand anything they were saying.

Tanzer: But you were with a number of other people from Rhodes.
TARICA: Yes, for the time being I was. I was lucky to be together with some of my friends that were older. I was one of youngest. But for a short time.

Tanzer: Then where were you assigned?
TARICA: They always separated us somehow, for some reason or other. Very often we used to have these physicals, checkups. Not checkups, just to be standing nude in front of an officer. If he felt we were strong enough to work, we were put on one side, and if not we were to be eliminated. Then I was separated from everybody because I was sick. I was put in an infirmary, and that was the end of it, really. From what I gather, once — we used to have this diarrhea, dysentery, that was very bad. There was no medication, nothing to control it. You just dehydrated and eventually died from it. But I was lucky enough to pull through.

Tanzer: How long were you in the infirmary?
TARICA: We didn’t know what day it was, what the week was, or what the month was. We didn’t know nothing. We were just like animals there, away from everything, from the world. We had no idea of what the time was.

Tanzer: Did you receive any care at all in the infirmary?
TARICA: No, nothing. We were just waiting to be cremated.

Tanzer: Did you know at that time what was happening to people?
TARICA: Yes.

Tanzer: How did you find out?
TARICA: You just gathered things, what was going around, what went around me, because it wasn’t — I couldn’t understand any other language. There were no Italian people, there weren’t Jewish, there weren’t — of course, nobody from the island of Rhodes, nobody. It was all Czechoslovakians, Hungarians, Russians, Polish. All these foreign languages. But you can gather things. if things were bad or good. But you didn’t know which way to go. It was just a chance.

Tanzer: But did you know that people from the infirmary were being taken out to the crematorium?
TARICA: Yes. They were all in bad shape, very bad.

Tanzer: How large was the infirmary?
TARICA: It was, I would say, about three times the size of this room, a large room with bunk beds and nothing else.

Tanzer: How many people?
TARICA: It was full.

Tanzer: What would you say in terms of numbers? Would there have been a hundred people?
TARICA: I would say 90, 100 people.

Tanzer: So when you were released from the infirmary, what happened?
TARICA: I was so weak and sick. Really, some of the things you just don’t remember. You just don’t. Anyway, I was assigned to another block, another barrack, and back to work.

Tanzer: What work did you do?
TARICA: We used to carry bricks for blocks and blocks, from one place to another, just getting bricks. They used to put us in line. That was the work we used to do, just going.

Tanzer: Were the bricks being used to build?
TARICA: We didn’t know what they were using them for. We didn’t know.

Tanzer: Were you fed?
TARICA: They used to feed us once a day. They used to give us half a cup of dark water, muddy water, that was supposed to be soup or coffee. We didn’t know what it was. At least it was something warm to put in our stomachs. And a half a slice of bread that would look like mud. Real heavy, dark bread.

Tanzer: Were you able to contact your family or other people from Rhodes?
TARICA: No, there was no way. We were surrounded by wires, and anybody that tried for anything to speak across the fence — we were scared, because we were watched all the time, and they used to beat us and punish us. The punishment was to get on your knees on a pile of rocks with your arms up high.

Tanzer: Were you punished?
TARICA: Yes.

Tanzer: Were you in any other camps, or did you remain in Auschwitz?
TARICA: I remained in Auschwitz all the time.

Tanzer: Where and when were you liberated?
TARICA: Again, we didn’t know the time or what month.

Tanzer: Tell me about the liberation.
TARICA: We were walking for days and nights. The crematoriums were going on full blast.

Tanzer: Had they taken you out of the camp? Is that why you were walking?
TARICA: Yes [inaudible] because we can hear the guns. The war was going on, we can hear, so we were just happy that the war was getting to an end.

Tanzer: But by this time you were able to communicate with people who were . . .
TARICA: No, it was a silent thing. I could never understand them. It was very hard.

Tanzer: But you could hear the guns.
TARICA: Yes, and I would just follow people, what they were doing, hoping that it was the right thing to do. We were walking, and I would stop — the last ones in line that they couldn’t walk any further, they would just kill them there. The Germans had the big shepherd dogs, and they used to jump on the people. Then they used to fall on the ground, and they used to kill them, right there and then. We were out of the camp and we didn’t know where we were going. We never stopped. We were on our feet day and night.

Tanzer: How many people were in this group?
TARICA: It was hundreds and hundreds.

Tanzer: Men and women?
TARICA: No, only women. From Auschwitz, only women. It was early in the morning and all of a sudden, we were just — in the meantime, we got less and less people left in this walking. And all of a sudden, we were just left all alone, isolated. The Germans left; they disappeared. They just disappeared. We really didn’t know what was going on. We saw some men, and then we saw some trucks, and then we thought that something good, hopefully, is happening. Soon enough, we discovered that the war was over. We just couldn’t believe it.

Tanzer: Who was it that liberated you?
TARICA: The Russians.

Tanzer: Where did they take you?
TARICA: They took us to another camp, to keep us together. It was a relief, and we felt good to see some people and not the Germans.

Tanzer: How were you treated by the Russians?
TARICA: Pretty mean. But they’re tough people. At least we were alive, and we didn’t have that fear of the Germans anymore. But they were strict. They were tough people, and they had to be careful. They weren’t kind at all. But at least we were hoping that someday the war is over, and we will come home and meet our families.

Tanzer: What happened to you from there, as an Italian citizen?
TARICA: I was the youngest, the only one Italian in that camp. They put all the nationalities together and they shipped them to their country, but I was alone there. There weren’t Italians. They put me in a train. They were taking me to Russia. They couldn’t make a group of people to ship them, so there was no place they can send me.

One night we were parked in this train, open cars. We were parked somewhere; I don’t know where it was. Another train stopped on the next track to ours, and I heard Italian voices. Of course, I was really run down and really sick. We were all sick. But the voices, I thought I was dreaming. I forced myself to stand up in the train. Because the trains were so close, we were able to communicate to see who they were and where they were going. They were Italian soldiers going back to Italy. I asked to talk to an officer, if they can take me to Italy because I didn’t know where they were taking me. They told me that they couldn’t take me to Italy. So the officer came, and he was nice, and we weren’t guarded then, nobody to watch us. I just ran over to their train and they took me. I was really very happy and very relieved, and they treated me just like a little toy. They took care of me and they were really nice.

Tanzer: Where did you go from there?
TARICA: We went to Bolzano on the Austria border from Italy. They took me to the hospital. They checked me over. I was there for a few days. It was a military hospital. Then the Red Cross tried to find out about my family, and I was able to find out my sister and my brothers were alive, and my uncles, my mother’s brothers. We weren’t together again. I was in Italy, and I stayed in a convent of nuns. I was living with them.

Tanzer: Where was this?
TARICA: In Bolzano, Merano [town near Bolzano]. I was studying there. I went to school with them. It was like a boarding school for girls.

Tanzer: Who made arrangements for you to stay there?
TARICA: The priest that used to come to the hospital, he took me in charge. He was the head of this school. It was run by nuns, and I stayed with them for eight months. They tried to convert me. I was alone, and if they could they would have. But that didn’t bother me. I went to mass every morning with them, and rosary, so I was praying to my God. Then an uncle of mine — we visited in the meantime with my uncle. They came to see me, and I went to see them. We keep in touch all the time. But I was all alone all the time. I don’t know, but somehow I just didn’t want to go where all the people were staying. There was a base in Rome, Bologna. I just stayed where I was. Then an uncle of mine, my mother’s brother, he lived in Africa, Belgian Congo. He really looked after us. He wasn’t involved during the war at all. He lived there all his life. He left the island of Rhodes when he was a little boy. He brought me to the Belgian Congo, made all the arrangements and papers.

Tanzer: What year was that?
TARICA: In 1946. I went to stay with him. He’s the one that brought me to this country.

Tanzer: How long were you in the Belgian Congo?
TARICA: I was there a year.

Tanzer: What was life like there?
TARICA: There? It was different but very nice, with lots of luxuries and maids and chauffeur. The easygoing life.

Tanzer: What about your brothers and sister?
TARICA: They stayed behind in Italy. They were going to school there. Both of my brothers were studying to be rabbis in the rabbinical college in Rome. They were hoping to come to this country, but on a quota it was too long of a wait for them, so my uncle took them to Africa. He made all the arrangements. He was our sponsor.

Tanzer: And your sister?
TARICA: My sister also.

Tanzer: Where are they now?
TARICA: One in Rome, one in South Africa, and my sister is here, in Seattle.

Tanzer: Are your brothers both rabbis?
TARICA: No, their plans were changed. They went into the business world, and they were in business in the Belgian Congo. They had their own business there. They lived there for a long time until the independence came.

Tanzer: Where are they now? One brother is in Rome, you said.
TARICA: Yes, and the other one is in South Africa.

Tanzer: When did you decide to leave the Belgian Congo, and why did you leave?
TARICA: It was my uncle that wanted to come to this country. He was single. He wanted to come to this country, so I lived with him and he brought me here with him.

Tanzer: Why did you decide to come to Seattle?
TARICA: We were destined to go to Los Angeles, California. We came here. It was a beautiful city, and we had some cousins here. They talked us into staying here.

Tanzer: Did you consider other countries in Europe or in Africa rather than the United States?
TARICA: Not really, no.

Tanzer: Do you remember the trip to the United States?
TARICA: Yes. It was a lot of flying. We went to Europe before we came here. We stayed in Europe for a while, and then we came to New York. It was flying all the way.

Tanzer: In what month and year was that?
TARICA: In December and January of 1946.

Tanzer: Who met you in New York?
TARICA: A friend of my uncle’s. We stayed with them in New York. We stayed there two weeks. It was quite an experience. America!

Tanzer: What were your initial feelings about America?
TARICA: Everything. I expected to see cowboys.

Tanzer: And you saw big buildings.
TARICA: Big buildings in New York [laughs].

Tanzer: How did you come to Seattle?
TARICA: By train.

Tanzer: What did you think of the country as you crossed?
TARICA: It was really something, so big and so rich and so much of everything.

Tanzer: Did you see any cowboys?
TARICA: No [laughs].

Tanzer: Have you ever seen any cowboys?
TARICA: No.

Tanzer: What would you say were your first impressions of this country?
TARICA: They were beautiful. It was a young country, full of life and a lot of action. It was a good feeling.

Tanzer: When you came to Seattle, where did you live at first?
TARICA: With a distant cousin, but related. We stayed with them in their home. They had room. They were very nice. He passed away.

Tanzer: Who were the people who helped you get settled, aside from these cousins?
TARICA: Nobody in particular, really.

Tanzer: Did you receive any help from the Sephardic . . .?

[Tape stops and then resumes. Apparently, there is a gap in the recording.]

TARICA: It’s hard to really understand something. A person has to go through it to really believe and feel.

Tanzer: Do they try to understand?
TARICA: Yes, they do try to understand, but not anymore now. Maybe 10, 15 years ago. Now it’s just all forgotten.

Tanzer: Do you think that American Jews care about being Jewish?
TARICA: Yes. All my friends, they care to be Jewish, yes.

Tanzer: How do they show it?
TARICA: Being active in our synagogue and make their children believe that they are good Jews, in that way.

Tanzer: And associating with Jewish causes in the community.
TARICA: Yes, activities and clubs.

Tanzer: Do you live in a Jewish neighborhood?
TARICA: Yes, although they’re moving now.

Tanzer: Where are they moving?
TARICA: On the east side, most of them are.

Tanzer: Why are they moving out of this neighborhood?
TARICA: Well, because the Negroes are coming in. But basically it’s a Jewish community here, neighborhood. It used to be more so, but they are moving. It’s so beautiful. It’s lovely around here. There are a lot of Jewish people in this area.

Tanzer: Do you have any non-Jewish friends?
TARICA: Yes.

Tanzer: Have you ever had any bad experiences with non-Jews?
TARICA: No.

Tanzer: Have you ever told non-Jews of your experiences?
TARICA: No. I don’t think so. I don’t remember.

Tanzer: Do you think that non-Jews would be able to understand this experience at all?
TARICA: Some people would. I’m sure they would be very understanding.

Tanzer: Do you ever see plays or movies that deal with the Holocaust?
TARICA: Yes, I have.

Tanzer: And what has been your reaction?
TARICA: It brings back memories. I don’t like to see everything that I — if there is a movie, I just walk away from it.

Tanzer: That’s understandable. What organizations do you belong to?
TARICA: Several. Hadassah, Sisterhood, my congregation, City of Hope. There might be one or two more.

Tanzer: Are you an active member?
TARICA: Yes.

Tanzer: What particular organization are you most active in?
TARICA: My synagogue.

Tanzer: What kind of a synagogue is it?
TARICA: Mainly it’s Orthodox, although we are not Orthodox [inaudible].

TAPE 1 SIDE 2

Tanzer: This is a continuation of an interview for the William E. Wiener Oral History Library’s Holocaust Project at Seattle, Washington on January 15, 1975. This is tape 1, side 2. Stella, you told me you belong to the Orthodox synagogue. How often do you attend?
TARICA: We attend several times during the year, but for sure we attend the holidays all the time.

Tanzer: Did you send your children to Hebrew and Sunday school?
TARICA: Yes.

Tanzer: Did they go to a yeshiva or day school at all?
TARICA: No. My youngest attended the Hebrew Academy, a day school, for a year, and of course they both attended daily religious school three times a week and Sundays.

Tanzer: Do you think that your children have had a good Jewish education?
TARICA: Going into that, it’s a little deep, but the Orthodox is not like the Reform, that they can really get a little more out of it. It’s a little harder when you’re not an Orthodox to really get a good education in the religious school, but they have.

Tanzer: Was the school they attended Reform or Orthodox?
TARICA: Orthodox. But they had a decent religious school.

Tanzer: Do they speak Hebrew?
TARICA: No, they don’t.

Tanzer: Do they read Hebrew?
TARICA: They might read a little bit, but they understand anyway.

Tanzer: What do you like to read?
TARICA: I read the newspapers and novels, biographies. I enjoy reading.

Tanzer: What was your latest book?
TARICA: The last one was — what is that? “After 40.” I can’t think of the name.

Tanzer: Have you read any books on the Holocaust?
TARICA: No.

Tanzer: In what languages do you read?
TARICA: English.

Tanzer: You don’t read in Spanish?
TARICA: No.

Tanzer: What are the newspapers that you read?
TARICA: The Times in New York, The Observer.

Tanzer: Do you read any Jewish newspapers at all?
TARICA: There is a local Jewish flyer that we get monthly. That is a Jewish paper.

Tanzer: Is that The Transcript [The Jewish Transcript of Seattle]?
TARICA: We get The Transcript, yes.

Tanzer: Is the flyer another newspaper?
TARICA: Yes, it’s a monthly paper that comes out for the community. It’s mainly from our synagogue.

Tanzer: I see.
TARICA: News among the Jewish people in Seattle.

Tanzer: But it is put out by . . .
TARICA: By the synagogue, yes.

Tanzer: Tell me, do you belong to a political party?
TARICA: No, I don’t really.

Tanzer: What is your voting preference?
TARICA: Democrat. That’s the only party that I belong to, but I’m not active.

Tanzer: Have you actively supported certain candidates?
TARICA: Yes. I voted for the last election and the time before.

Tanzer: On what do you base your support?
TARICA: On the person.

Tanzer: Do you like the American system of government?
TARICA: Yes.

Tanzer: Do you think it works?
TARICA: I think so. Sure it does.

Tanzer: How do you feel about Henry Kissinger being Secretary of State?
TARICA: I think he’s a great man. He’s done a lot of good for this country.

Tanzer: What about his efforts on behalf of Israel?
TARICA: I think he’s working hard at it. He’s trying.

Tanzer: Do you think that his being Jewish puts him into a particularly difficult position?
TARICA: It might have something to do with it, but he’s trying very hard to do his best.

Tanzer: What do you think are the really important issues facing the United States today? First of all, if you could think nationally about what the really important problems are.
TARICA: The Angola problem has been getting a lot in the news.

Tanzer: How do you feel about the United States participating in the Angola struggle?
TARICA: I feel the United States helps all the countries in the world all the time, and I think it’s a good thing. If they can help, I think it’s a good thing.

Tanzer: Do you think that there are other national problems that are very important?
TARICA: There is always something more important going on in the world that might need more attention, but I suppose they know what they’re doing.

Tanzer: Internally, within the United States, would you say that a great problem is the problem of inflation, something of this sort?
TARICA: We hope the inflation will change soon so the American dollar can have more value.

Tanzer: Do you think that there is a danger of antisemitism in the United States?
TARICA: I hope not.

Tanzer: But regardless of what your hopes are, living as a citizen in this part of the country and perhaps with the traveling you do, do you think that there is a danger?
TARICA: I just don’t see it. I don’t see how in this country can be anything. Hopefully, there won’t be any.

Tanzer: Have you ever been to Israel?
TARICA: No, not yet.

Tanzer: Do you want to go?
TARICA: Someday, yes. I would like to.

Tanzer: Do you have family there?
TARICA: No, nobody.

Tanzer: No one went there. What are your feelings about Germany and present-day Germans?
TARICA: I have no feelings for the Germans. I’m sure the average citizens are not responsible for what we went through, what they did to us, but I just have no feelings for them.

Tanzer: Do you buy German products?
TARICA: No, I don’t.

Tanzer: Did you get any restitution payments?
TARICA: Very little, yes. Not from the Germans, from the Italian government.

Tanzer: Did you have any doubts about accepting them?
TARICA: No. The amount they gave us meant nothing, really. It was just a minimum. I donated my money anyway when I received it, so I wanted to get whatever was coming to me. Why leave it to them?

Tanzer: How do your children feel about Germany and the Germans?
TARICA: I’m sure they don’t hate the people, but they don’t have any feelings toward them, either.

Tanzer: Do you think that you or they would ever go to Germany?
TARICA: I don’t think so. I have no desire.

Tanzer: Are you happy that you came to America?
TARICA: Yes.

Tanzer: How have your wartime experiences affected you as a person?
TARICA: It has done a lot of damage to me, but I’m trying to forget things and be happy with my life now and my family.

Tanzer: Do you feel more or less Jewish today than you did before the war?
TARICA: No, I think I feel more Jewish now. I feel maybe not more Jewish, but I feel pretty strong to be Jewish.

Tanzer: To what do you attribute this?
TARICA: I suffer what I went through just because I was Jewish.

Tanzer: And that made you feel stronger about being . . .
TARICA: Yes, I think so.

Tanzer: Was there ever a time, Stella, where you doubted your Jewishness in all of this experience?
TARICA: Yes, there were times that just to be Jewish, to go through all this suffering, it wasn’t a happy thing. And why we have to be suffering the way we did, gone through what we went through just to be Jewish. But I always felt strong to be Jewish.

Tanzer: Do you feel that the general American public is interested in the Holocaust, or in your experiences?
TARICA: I don’t know. So many years have gone by now that people forget.

Tanzer: Do you think that they should be interested?
TARICA: They should be interested, yes.

Tanzer: Why?
TARICA: Because it could have been them.