Helen Bissinger Bloch

Bissinger: We are going to go back in time and try to put together a history of our family and see if we can’t get some of the loose pieces to come together. My grandfather, your father, Newton Bissinger, was born in 1877. Is that correct?
BLOCH: Yes, I think it is correct.

Bissinger: In Ichenhausen, Germany?
BLOCH: Ichenhausen. I was there three times, so I’ve seen his house.

Bissinger: The house is still standing?
BLOCH: The house is still standing. But Ichenhausen, the last time I was there, it was really a metropolis [compared] to what it was at first. The first time I was there, we had a devil of a time trying to find it, even Mrs. Lundy. It was a little bit of a berg. You’ve never seen anything like it. And Main Street, going down. The postmaster lived in the house where your grandfather, my father, and the whole family lived. Well, when I went upstairs to the room that Uncle Sam and Papa had — of course, don’t forget that when I talk about Papa, I mean your grandfather and my father. He left there when he was about 13 years old, and he came to this country.

Bissinger: What kind of house is it?
BLOCH: It’s a little two-by-four and would be like one in the poorest district in town here.

Bissinger: Is that because all the Jews were relegated to that part of town?
BLOCH: No, no, no. In those days, I don’t think so; it was mostly a Jewish town. When I went to the cemetery there, there were nothing but Jewish names.

Bissinger: Were there other Bissingers in the cemetery?
BLOCH: Oh, sure.

Bissinger: You did find some?
BLOCH: Yes, my father’s father and relatives of his. There were several Bissingers there. They all came from there. Sam Bissinger came from there, Isadore — I’ll tell you all of their names as we go along.

Bissinger: Newton Bissinger had one brother, Sam. Is that correct?
BLOCH: Newton Bissinger had one brother, Sam, and he had some sisters.

Bissinger: Oh, he did? I don’t know anything about the sisters.
BLOCH: Yes, Anna. Well, you know Alfred Goodwin up in Portland. His mother was my father’s sister.

Bissinger: Alfred Goodwin’s mother was one of Newton’s sisters?
BLOCH: Yes.

Bissinger: Do you know which one?
BLOCH: Anna, I think her name was. He had two sisters, I think.

Bissinger: Do you know the other’s name?
BLOCH: Yes, one was Sarah, but she went kind of bad. We didn’t talk about her.

Bissinger: What do you mean by bad?
BLOCH: I think they had some trouble, and she had an illegitimate child. I remember hearing something about that.

Bissinger: I’m glad we have a little spice in the family!
BLOCH: Well, that was so many years ago, but I know they had a little trouble with Sarah.

Bissinger: Were these older or younger? Do you know the order?
BLOCH: The oldest one was Sam. I think Papa was the youngest one. I’m not sure.

Bissinger: And the girls were in the middle?
BLOCH: And the girls were in the middle.

Bissinger: So there were two boys and two girls?
BLOCH: I think there were two boys and two girls. My grandfather, you’ve seen pictures of him, haven’t you?

Bissinger: I don’t think I have.
BLOCH: I’ll get you one. I had one of Papa’s father.

Bissinger: What was his name?
BLOCH: Oh, gosh. It will come back to me. You know you are asking me ancient history.

Bissinger: I know.
BLOCH: I was thinking today. I was trying to remember something of the family. There is nobody left but me, and the other nearest relative would be Bob Levison. He’s 85. I’m going to be 82 this week.

Bissinger: We’ll get to him, but I don’t know how he’s related to us.
BLOCH: I’ll come to that.

Bissinger: In any event, do you remember his mother’s name?
BLOCH: I don’t think so, but I can look it up.

Bissinger: Maybe we can find that later.
BLOCH: Yes, I would have to go through a lot of stuff.

Bissinger: Did your father ever talk to you about his childhood?
BLOCH: His childhood was really no childhood. He left Ichenhausen when he was either 12 or 13.

Bissinger: He didn’t talk about life in Germany before he came to this country?
BLOCH: Well, he had hardly any schooling, and it was very difficult. They were all huddled together in this house, and he came over steerage on some ship. I think Uncle Sam Bissinger sent him a little money to come over.

Bissinger: He had two uncles in the country, Sam and Isadore?
BLOCH: Yes, and also he had another uncle [and aunt?] who took him in, Della Fleishhacker’s mother and Alice Levison’s mother. Just trying to think what their names were. I can look up some of these people. Even though I’m going to be 82, I knew them as a little girl very slightly. Gerstle!

Bissinger: Gerstle Bissinger?
BLOCH: No, his last name was Gerstle. He was related to somebody in the family, and Papa always called him uncle.

Bissinger: That must be the Gerstle family that we know.
BLOCH: Yes. Alice Levison and Della Fleishhacker, those are all the family.

Bissinger: So his life in Germany. Were they very poor?
BLOCH: Oh, very poor.

Bissinger: What did his parents do?
BLOCH: His father, I don’t really know. I don’t think he did very much. From the time I was born, Papa was supporting him and Uncle Sam, sending money over. He didn’t have very much. But you didn’t need much to live on in those days.

Bissinger: So he came over around 1890, when he was about 13.
BLOCH: Yes, when he was about 12 or 13. I think he didn’t speak a word of English. And he went to the Gerstles, and they kept him.

Bissinger: Here in San Francisco?
BLOCH: First he came to New York, and then he came out here. They sent him to the Belmont School to learn a little English, if I’m not mistaken.

Bissinger: Do you know how he came across the country?
BLOCH: Yes, steerage on some ship.

Bissinger: No, across the United States.
BLOCH: I have no idea.

Bissinger: There were trains in 1890.
BLOCH: He always said steerage and not a word of English, and he came over here. And he did stay with some of the Gerstles for a little while. He was a young fellow. Then he went up to Portland. He went into business up there first.

Bissinger: Didn’t he first go into business with his uncles?
BLOCH: He went into business with Isadore. No, Isadore didn’t work. It was Mac’s father, Adolph, and Sam, here in San Francisco that you asked me about.

Bissinger: Sam Bissinger and Adolph Mac?
BLOCH: No, Adolph Bissinger. That was Mac’s father.

Bissinger: I see. Now how was Adolph Bissinger related to Newton Bissinger?
BLOCH: Adolph was his uncle.

Bissinger: I see. So Adolph was one of Newton Bissinger’s father’s brothers?
BLOCH: Yes. Adolph Bissinger was married twice. Mac’s father and mother, I think the mother was killed, if I’m not mistaken, and Uncle Adolph married again. But Adolph got mad at your grandfather when he went into business for himself. That’s when the family kind of . . .

Bissinger: What was Adolph’s business?
BLOCH: It was hides.

Bissinger: That was an outgrowth of the Alaska commercial company?
BLOCH: That I can’t tell you. Bob [Bloch] could tell you that.

Bissinger: But didn’t Newton first work with his uncles in San Francisco?
BLOCH: No, he worked up in Portland.

Bissinger: So he didn’t want to work with his uncles?
BLOCH: He didn’t go to work right away. He had to learn English first.

Bissinger: I see. Now to go back a step. Did Sam come over at the same time?
BLOCH: No, Sam came over ahead.

Bissinger: His brother Sam we’re talking about?
BLOCH: His brother Sam came over ahead, a few years before.

Bissinger: And where did Sam go?
BLOCH: Sam came here to San Francisco. The details of that I can’t be sure of, and I don’t think there is anybody living who could tell you.

Bissinger: Well, I do remember Sam.
BLOCH: You remember Sam, yes.

Bissinger: A character.
BLOCH: A character. Well, there were a few characters that you will come across.

Bissinger: I’m getting lost on all the names. We should sit down later and try to put them on paper and see how they all connect. It seems like Newton Bissinger’s father had a lot of brothers.
BLOCH: You can’t prove it by me, but I think he did. You see, I never met him, but your father did. Your father met Papa’s father once. It was 63 years ago, that was when I was married. I was married 63 years ago last September. Mama and Papa and Paul, your father, went to Europe, and they went to Ichenhausen. Papa always went over there. He was awfully good to the town. In fact, the last time I was there, the town crier or whatever he was came out to see me, and Papa gave money to them, and I gave money to them. The city of Ichenhausen had grown, as I say, to quite a metropolis the last time I was there.

Bissinger: How old do you think Newton was when he moved up to Portland?
BLOCH: He was maybe 16 years old.

Bissinger: And he started out in business by himself?
BLOCH: No. They had this company up there at the beginning, and he worked for them. He went out on the road. His very good friend was my mother’s brother, Joe Heilner. That was how he met your grandmother Millie. He traveled for them, and he went to Baker on business. That’s where he met mother. He was a friend of Joe’s.

Bissinger: Of course, your mother was . . .
BLOCH: Was a Heilner.

Bissinger: And Joe Heilner was. . .
BLOCH: My mother’s brother.

Bissinger: Your mother’s brother.
BLOCH: And a friend of my father’s, that’s how they met. And I know Papa was traveling.

Bissinger: I want to go back for a minute to all of these uncles — Isadore, Sam, and who was the other?
BLOCH: Adolph.

Bissinger: Now, they were married. You said Adolph was married twice.
BLOCH: Yes, Adolph was married twice, and Mac was the son of one of his wives.

Bissinger: McKinley Bissinger? There is a McKinley Bissinger I know who just died.
BLOCH: Well, he has been dead for a long time, but he wouldn’t know anything. He wouldn’t know one thing. He used to ask me questions. He never knew anybody in the family. He wasn’t interested particularly.

Bissinger: How about the other uncles? Did they ever get married?
BLOCH: Isadore never married, Sam never married. I don’t think any of them got married.

Bissinger: So the only ones who got married were . . .
BLOCH: Papa and Adolph and Sam. There were two Sam Bissingers. One Sam Bissinger was married to Emma Straus.

Bissinger: The two Sams I can think of, one is Newton’s brother, and he never married. And the other one is his uncle.
BLOCH: Yes. The uncle was Emma Bissinger’s husband.

Bissinger: OK, so there is that connection there. Now what did those uncles do? Sam and Isadore and Adolph.
BLOCH: Well, Isadore never did anything to my knowledge. I think for a little time he was in the hide business. Adolph and Sam were in the hide business, and when Papa — see, I can’t tell you too much about what any of them did. I only know Isadore never worked very much that I can think of.

Bissinger: Do you remember these uncles very well?
BLOCH: I remember Isadore.

Bissinger: What kind of person was he?
BLOCH: Peculiar. He was my least favorite, and Adolph I hardly knew. I was a tiny little girl when I met him. He has been dead for years. Uncle Sam, I remember very distinctly. Both Sams, the Sam here and the Sam up in Portland who was father’s brother.

Bissinger: The Uncle Sam who was down here, what kind of person was he?
BLOCH: He was a very cute little man who loved rye and loved to have a good time. He was a very short man, and he was married to Emma Straus. And she just adored. She was an awfully peculiar woman, but I loved her, and I’ll tell you more about her when we get to her.

Bissinger: We can come back to that. I’m trying today to tie all the pieces together. So he moved up to Portland when he was 16, and he worked for his uncles?
BLOCH: Well, I wouldn’t swear to what age he was, but he was very young, and he went right to work. He had to educate himself. They sent him to Belmont, where he learned some English, and he learned a little bit, but he had no schooling.

Bissinger: This is Belmont down the peninsula?
BLOCH: Yes. It was different in those days, naturally. Your father on the 12th of June would be 80.

Bissinger: That’s right.
BLOCH: Yes. So you can imagine how much thinking I’ve had to do. I’m an old lady, and I’ve been sick, and my mind isn’t as clear as it used to be.

Bissinger: It’s operating very well.
BLOCH: It’ll come back to me. I’ve been trying to think.

Bissinger: Now, up in Portland he started to work very young with not much formal education.
BLOCH: And he worked like the devil. When he fell in love with your grandmother, my mother, I think the Heilners gave him a little money, and we had a little house on Marshall Street. Paul, your father, was born on Marshall Street.

Bissinger: That’s up in Portland?
BLOCH: Yes. We were both born in Portland, your father and me.

Bissinger: How old was Newton when you got married?
BLOCH: He was 25 years older than I, and I was born about two and a half years after they were married. So he was very young, 23, maybe 20 [ed: when he got married?].

Bissinger: What year were you married?
BLOCH: I was married in 1921, I think, the first time.

Bissinger: 1921. So we knock off about 27 or 28 years from that year. He was 25 when you married?
BLOCH: I said he was 25 years older than I.

Bissinger: OK. So 1921 minus 25 is about 1896. That’s about when he [Newton] got married.
BLOCH: About that. I can get the exact time. I have that all, Paul, because I have the cemetery and all that.

Bissinger: How wonderful. Now, Joe Heilner, who is the brother of Mildred [Millie], my grandmother, was he in the hide business? How did Newton know him?
BLOCH: No, he was a lawyer. They were friends, they met someplace. You see, mother had three brothers.

Bissinger: What were their names?
BLOCH: Stanford Heilner, Joe Heilner, and Jeffrey Heilner. She was the only girl.

Bissinger: Were they older?
BLOCH: Stanford was the youngest, and mother was the second. Jeffrey was the oldest, and then Joe.

Bissinger: I know that the Heilners lived in Baker, Oregon, in eastern Oregon. Do you know anything about their background, where they came from?
BLOCH: They all came from Germany. I can easily find out. I can look that up for you.

Bissinger: You don’t know what part of Germany?
BLOCH: One of those little places, Dinkelspiel or one of them. I don’t know if that was the name of the place they came from. They did not come from Ichenhausen.

Bissinger: I see. Did you ever meet Millie’s parents?
BLOCH: Certainly. I stayed with them when my mother and father went to Europe, both your father and I did. We went up to Baker, and we stayed with them. My grandfather was the one who did all of that drawing in the office, the man with the cigar and all that. He loved to paint.

Bissinger: Really?
BLOCH: Oh, yes.

Bissinger: I didn’t know that.
BLOCH: He loved to paint, and they had the store up there. Newberger-Heilner, it was called in those days.

Bissinger: Newberger-Heilner.
BLOCH: Yes, or Heilner-Newberger. I think that is how it was. They brought over my grandmother’s two nephews from Germany.

Bissinger: This is the Heilner grandmother?
BLOCH: The Heilner grandmother. And they all lived together in Baker City.

Bissinger: I see. What were their names, Mildred’s parents?
BLOCH: Clara and Isadore.

Bissinger: Isadore Heilner and Clara Heilner. And that’s why one of the daughters is named Clare.
BLOCH: Well, I don’t know if she was named — but Clara was her name, Clara Heilner. She was very, very pretty. Sigmund! His name was Sigmund.

Bissinger: Sigmund. Sigmund and Clara?
BLOCH: Yes.

Bissinger: Do you know what her maiden name was?
BLOCH: I can look that up for you.

Bissinger: They were first-generation Americans?
BLOCH: Oh, yes.

Bissinger: Clara and Sigmund?
BLOCH: They were the first family in Baker City. And there were four children and the two nephews, and they all lived together. When my mother and father went to Europe, we would go up there and stay with them for the summer.

Bissinger: That’s very interesting.
BLOCH: I knew them all very well.

Bissinger: I see. So Newton, through his friend Joe Heilner . . .
BLOCH: Met mama.

Bissinger: Met Mildred. Did they ever talk about their courting?
BLOCH: Yes. They came into the house, this house in Baker. It’s still there. One of the cousins, the only one left now, lives in that house. When I was a little girl, it was quite a house. There was one big room that was the bathroom. I can see it in front of me. In fact, the old-fashioned way was by the toilet having curtains around it. My mother, who was always a very fussy housekeeper, was scrubbing the floors. They came in, and when Joe introduced Mama to Papa, she had been scrubbing the floor. That’s how they met. It was through Joe that they met.

Bissinger: Was this love at first sight?
BLOCH: How do I know, Paul? It went pretty quickly. They were married. If ever I have seen a couple worship each other, it was my mother and father. Your grandmother used to say, “My Newtie, my Helen, my Paul.” But “My Newtie,” she always said, my Newtie.

Bissinger: That’s very sweet.
BLOCH: Oh, she worshipped him, and he worshipped her.

Bissinger: Do you recollect much about your childhood in Portland?
BLOCH: Oh, I remember a lot of it. I went to the Couch School. I was 12 years old when we moved to San Francisco.

Bissinger: Let’s talk about the time before you came to San Francisco.
BLOCH: I was a little girl. My intimate friends, most of who are dead now, we all went to school together. We went to the Couch School in Portland.

Bissinger: The Coots School?
BLOCH: Couch [spells out], in Portland. There was Jeanette Meyer, and there were all the Meyer girls, Elsa and Jean, among my best friends. Delphine Koshland is still a very intimate friend of mine. She and I are alive. Most everybody else is dead of my intimate friends.

Bissinger: And did you have boyfriends before 12 years old?
BLOCH: No.

Bissinger: Not in those days?
BLOCH: No.

Bissinger: Not at all? Was this a coed school or a girls’ school?
BLOCH: It was a coed school. In those days, they didn’t have those specialty schools. I was a little girl, then we moved down here.

Bissinger: What was your house like in Portland?
BLOCH: It was a very plain little house. I was born on Johnson Street. The house I was born in is down, but the house that your father was born in is still up.

Bissinger: That’s on Marshall Street?
BLOCH: 733 or 773 Marshall Street.

Bissinger: What kind of house was it?
BLOCH: A very simple house. Your grandfather was not a millionaire in those days, believe me.

Bissinger: By then, of course, he was in business for himself?
BLOCH: When he decided to go into business by himself, the whole family got mad at him. Adolph got very angry at him. Both Emma Bissinger and Elsie Ehrman, I don’t suppose you ever knew of them, but they were children of Adolph, Emma and Elsie. Elsie was Elsie Bissinger, and she was the one who was married to — she had seven sons, and the sons are still alive, the Ehrmans. She married Ehrman. Emma, I think, is still alive but pretty sick. One of them is dead and one is alive, but I don’t know. I haven’t seen them in years.

Bissinger: My father, Paul, was born two years after you?
BLOCH: Two and a half years after me. His birthday was in June. Mine is in February.

Bissinger: Now tell me about your parents’ relationship with each other. Your father was always a very hard worker.
BLOCH: Worked like a dog, but they had a wonderful life in Portland with Paul and me, and they had many friends. They were a young couple.

Bissinger: Who were my father’s friends, do you remember?
BLOCH: Your father was a baby when we came down here. He really had no friends up there because he was younger than I. Don’t forget, he had just started in school. He knew the Meyer boys, Roger and Alan, but I don’t think your father really was friendly with anybody in those days.

Bissinger: Well, he was so young.
BLOCH: He was a kid, a baby. And when he came down here, then of course we went to school.

Bissinger: Did your father dote on you?
BLOCH: I don’t think he doted on me any more than he did on your father. Your father was mother’s favorite. She worshipped him. But they were wonderful to both of us, they really adored both of us.

Bissinger: I never knew your mother, Millie, and the only thing I’ve ever heard about her is through my father, who said that she took the curtains down once a week and washed them.
BLOCH: She was on her hands and knees scrubbing every day of her life. It was an obsession with her. They actually told me she died of a thyroid second operation. It was almost like a sickness with her, this obsession with cleaning.

Bissinger: Did she have outside interests?
BLOCH: Yes, her family. She wasn’t a society person by any means. She was crazy about her home. She never went out in the mornings because she liked to stay home and clean. They went out to dinner at night, but she was very happy to be at home. Mama was not a society person. She was pretty as a picture.

Bissinger: I’ve seen pictures of her.
BLOCH: She was awfully pretty.

Bissinger: When you went over to Baker, Oregon, to visit the Heilners, how did you get there?
BLOCH: We took the train.

Bissinger: How long did it take?
BLOCH: Overnight. I have a picture. We’ll go upstairs afterwards because I don’t like to walk up and down too many times, and I’ll let Matthew go in and get this picture of when we first moved to San Francisco. You’ll get a kick out of it. You’ll see Paul and me there at a birthday party of mine, with Mama and Papa. I guess I was 12 and Paul was nine or ten. I’ll show you a picture that I have upstairs. Matthew can go in the closet and fetch it. I can’t do it.
Bissinger: And what did you do when you went visiting Baker, Oregon?

BLOCH: We went down to the store, we went to the movies. We both ran away once. We were mad at Grandma for something and hid behind the couch. By golly, they didn’t find us. But when they did find us, God, I got the worst spanking you ever could imagine. Uncle Joe gave it to me too, I remember that. We were little kids and did the usual things. Grandma was always the center of everything, and she loved to bake. She had a pantry with all kinds of cakes that she made. Everybody came home for lunch, so we all sat around the lunch table and the dinner table. There was a big crowd of us with all the boys there. I can’t tell you all that we did, but we always looked forward to it.

Bissinger: I’m sure. Did anybody own a car in those days?
BLOCH: No, but we had a car and a driver when we moved to San Francisco. It was an EMF. I don’t know if you have ever heard of it. It was used partly for business, Papa used the car, and we had a driver by the name of George Stetson. My God, Paul, I haven’t thought of this in 80 years.

Bissinger: Let’s talk about your move to San Francisco. Was that discussed for a long time?
BLOCH: Well, if it was, I didn’t hear too much of it. We moved to San Francisco, and we went to the Richard Yube Hotel on Van Ness Avenue. That’s not the name now, but that’s where we lived.

Bissinger: I remember it.
BLOCH: And then after that, what did we do next? I went to school. I was sent to Miss Murison’s.

Bissinger: Miss Murison’s?
BLOCH: Miss Murison’s, yes. It was a private school.

Bissinger: How do you spell that?
BLOCH: Murison [spells out]. And then I think we lived a little while at the Fairmont, and then, of course, we lived at 3340 Jackson Street, the house that the Dolbys have been building and rebuilding for years.

Bissinger: Dolbys?
BLOCH: Dolbys.

Bissinger: Really, you lived in that house?
BLOCH: That’s where I was married from.

Bissinger: For heaven’s sake. So you were about 12 years old when you moved down here?
BLOCH: I was 11 or 12. I’ll show you a picture, and you can guess yourself.

Bissinger: Where did my father go to school?
BLOCH: He went to the Pacific Heights, and he went to Grant, I think, for a little while.

Bissinger: Do you remember who your friends were when you moved down to San Francisco, when you were teenagers?
BLOCH: Yes. The Portland girls didn’t come down until afterwards. I went to dancing class at Mrs. Haus’s. In those days, Mrs. Haus lived on [blank space in original transcript] Avenue. There was Eleanor Koshland, Margaret, Ruth, Lillian [another blank space]. They were a little older than I, but that is when I first came to San Francisco. Then later on, when we all got married — and we all got married young — all the Portland girls came down here.

Bissinger: Were you a good student?
BLOCH: No, Paul was better than I.

Bissinger: Did you not care about school?
BLOCH: Certainly not! My mother used to say, “If Helen doesn’t go dancing every Friday and Saturday night, she thinks she is abused.”

Bissinger: What kind of dancing did they do in those days?
BLOCH: Like at the St. Francis, and we used to have dancing classes.

Bissinger: Did you do things like the fox trot and waltz?
BLOCH: Oh, sure. And we had wonderful times. I went to a dancing class called — Mrs. Frank was her name. It was on Saturday mornings. And one Saturday morning, before we went to dancing class, I smoked a cigarette. That’s how many years ago that was. No wonder I have such terrible emphysema. I was at the window and dropped it down, and my mother came in and said, “Is somebody smoking?” I said, “I don’t know. I don’t know anything.” We had a cook by the name of Tooshoo.

Bissinger: Tooshoo? Is that oriental?
BLOCH: Sure. And when I came home from dancing class, he had taken Mama down and shown her all the cigarette butts in the yard. Mama said to me, “Just wait till your father comes home. I’m going to tell him.” And of course, Papa said his heart was broken and this and that. Then I got dumped to Miss Murison’s. That’s when I went to private school.

Bissinger: They thought you’d behave better?
BLOCH: Well, I was maybe 13 then and was smoking a cigarette, and I lied about it. I said, “No, I hadn’t smoked.”

Bissinger: So tell us about the house that the Dolbys are now fixing up. That was your first house in San Francisco?
BLOCH: That was the second house. The first house was where the Presbyterian Hospital is now, right opposite your grandmother, Florence Walter. We lived across the street from Florence Walter, on Buchanan Street.

Bissinger: On Buchanan Street, where the hospital is now?
BLOCH: Yes. I remember when your uncle died. I remember the funeral. Isn’t that funny how things come back?

Bissinger: Which uncle?
BLOCH: Marjorie’s [Marjorie Bissinger’s] brother.

Bissinger: Marjorie’s brother who died when he was a teenager?
BLOCH: Yes, that’s the one I remember.

Bissinger: What type of a house was that on Buchanan Street?
BLOCH: It was a great big house, very impressive. Our house on Buchanan Street was a nice little house, nothing wonderful. The Harts lived down the street. Several people that you wouldn’t know were neighbors. But of course, that house is all down. The second house we had was this one that the Dolbys have, and then Fannie Green had it after us.

Bissinger: I see. How long did you live in the house on Buchanan Street?
BLOCH: For about five to six years, as far as I can remember.

Bissinger: Then how long did you live in the house on Jackson Street?
BLOCH: I got married, and shortly after Mama and Papa went to Europe with your father. When they came back, they decided they’d take an apartment, which they did, on Jackson Street. So they got rid of the house.

Bissinger: I see. How much schooling did you have?
BLOCH: I went to Miss Murison’s, and I went to Pacific Heights, and I went to Mills College.

Bissinger: Did you finish college?
BLOCH: Certainly not. I was there for a little over two years and got married.

Bissinger: When you went to Mills, did you live there? Did they have a dormitory?
BLOCH: Oh, sure. It was a girls’ college in those days.

Bissinger: Yes, I think it still is.
BLOCH: No, I don’t think so.

Bissinger: What subjects did you enjoy?
BLOCH: I’ve always said sewing, cooking, and choral because I was no student. I’ve always enjoyed history. I never really cared much for any of them.

Bissinger: Now, was Paul always the good boy and you were always in trouble?
BLOCH: No, I wasn’t in trouble. He was a better student than I was, and he did just darn what he wanted to do.

Bissinger: How did you get along, the two of you?
BLOCH: Well, I was much fonder of him than he was of me, to be honest with you.

Bissinger: Did you fight? Most kids most certainly do fight.
BLOCH: No, we didn’t fight. But if Mama would get mad at me, he’d side with Mama. He was that type of a guy. And I remember a couple of times she’d say, “Where are you going tonight?” And he’d tell her. It was Mary Goldman, as a matter of fact. Mother would say, “How can you go there? You’ve never taken her out. You don’t like her.” He said, “I know. You’re perfectly right, but they give good parties.”

Bissinger: Well, that’s not a half-bad reason.
BLOCH: It was not a half-bad reason, but your father — he reminds me a little bit of Mr. Reagan in that he’d [blank space in original transcript] greater compliment with charm.

Bissinger: What did you do for recreation? Did you travel a lot?
BLOCH: No. We went to Tahoe every summer and we went to Coronado. And I did travel, both of us did, in our earlier days because your grandfather traveled a lot on these business trips, and they took us with them.

Bissinger: To what kind of places?
BLOCH: Boston, New York, Philadelphia, all those places where there were leather companies.

Bissinger: Did you go to Europe as a child?
BLOCH: No, I never went to Europe until after I was married.

Bissinger: I see. And where did you stay at Tahoe?
BLOCH: We stayed at Tallac [Mt. Tallac]. In those days, it was open. It was a marvelous place. And then later on at the cabin.

Bissinger: I see. How old were you when your mother died? How old was your mother when she died?
BLOCH: She was just 50.

Bissinger: Was she very much younger than your father?
BLOCH: No, they were practically the same age, just a couple of years difference.

Bissinger: So that must have been about 1930?
BLOCH: She was very young when she died. She might have been 49. She died of a goiter, and she never came out of the anesthetic.

Bissinger: Did she die in a hospital? Had she been sick for long?
BLOCH: She’d had an operation before. And she was sick before, she really was. Of course, Bob was born. Bob [Bloch] knew my mother.

Bissinger: That’s right. He has mentioned that to me.
BLOCH: She just worshipped the ground he walked on, just worshipped him.

Bissinger: I would imagine in those days, when you were young, there was a very close society, and all the same people saw each other.
BLOCH: Oh, yes. We had wonderful times. We used to have subscription dances, and it was very festive, a lot of people. There were debuts in those days, gorgeous balls for Marjorie Wheel and a lot of these people who came out. And there were very elaborate parties.

Bissinger: But the Jews kept to themselves. They were not integrated the way they are today.
BLOCH: Not quite as much. I always went with a certain amount of them. Of course, I began social work very young. And as you know, one of my closest friends is Elana Madison. But it was much more of a clique-ey crowd in those days.

Bissinger: Yes, I remember. Wasn’t there a country club of the peninsula that was Jewish?
BLOCH: Yes, Barrister.

Bissinger: Did you go there very much?
BLOCH: We belonged, yes. I didn’t go there very much. I was never an athlete. Bob’s [Bob Bloch’s] father was quite a golf player. He was a great athlete and one of the handsomest men I’ve ever seen. I’ll tell you who looks a little like him is . . .

Bissinger: Really? That’s very interesting. Of course, I never knew him. Now, I wanted to go back to one other group of the family. I’ve never really known how they are related, the Goodwins, Max and Alfred.
BLOCH: They were the children of my father’s sister.

Bissinger: Newton’s sister back in Germany? And how did they come to this country?
BLOCH: Sam always said that he brought them over. I think Father had a lot to do with that, my father. I think he sent them money. That brought them over, and he put them in business.

Bissinger: Wasn’t this in the 1930s?
BLOCH: Honey, I can’t remember exactly. I hate to say it was because I don’t remember.

Bissinger: My memory seems to tell me that they were brought over when things started getting very bad for the Jews in Germany.
BLOCH: Well, I think they did. They wanted to come over.

Bissinger: Did your father bring other family people over?
BLOCH: There was no other family, none of his sisters. But he was awfully good to the children. He was very good to Alfred and the other one up in Salt Lake.

Bissinger: No, Alfred was in Salt Lake, and I think Max was up in Vancouver.
BLOCH: Yes, Max is the one I was thinking of. Max is dead now [blank space in original transcript].

Bissinger: That’s right. Did Max ever marry?
BLOCH: Yes, he married Lillian.

Bissinger: Lillian who, do you remember? Did they have any children?
BLOCH: I think they adopted.

Bissinger: So we were talking about your father, and you were about to say?
BLOCH: I said that I have always admired my father, and I remember so much his telling me things that stuck in my mind. Now, I will admit that for many, many years, I haven’t thought of these things. There is nobody left to even talk to about it. We really have very little old family left.

Bissinger: Does Jack Bissinger know much of your side of things?
BLOCH: I don’t think he knows anything. I don’t think he knows much about his mother’s side, but there wasn’t too much to know. I adored her, but she was a peculiar woman. She loved to stay home, and Uncle Sam was full of life. His best friend was Georgie Ehrman. Up at Tahoe, they liked to go swimming. I remember his going down to the lake and starting to take off his robe. “Oh, my God! I forgot to put on a bathing suit.” He had a cute sense of humor. None of his boys were at all like him. Ed was a good-looking fellow. You remember Edgar, I’m sure.

Bissinger: No, I don’t. I don’t think I ever knew Edgar.
BLOCH: Did you ever know Jack?

Bissinger: I met Jack, Jr. a few times. I’m going to go over and see them. We’ll get to that. When you moved to San Francisco, did your mother become interested in anything around town? Did she ever get involved in any charitable work?
BLOCH: No, my mother led a very quiet life. They were invited out a great deal socially. They went out. She never went out much in the mornings. She had a car and a driver. But she was so young when she died, she was just a young woman.

Bissinger: That’s true. The same age as I am now, younger. Did they go to concerts?
BLOCH: Mother loved music.

Bissinger: She did?
BLOCH: She loved music, and she loved the opera. And she went East with Father, she went to Europe with my father. That’s when we stayed with my grandmother. And a couple of times, my grandfather and grandmother came down to Portland and took care of us, Paul and myself.

Bissinger: This is your grandmother in Baker, Oregon?
BLOCH: In Baker. I never knew any other.

Bissinger: So she loved music. Did you have a Victrola?
BLOCH: We had a piano, and we had a Victrola in those days.

Bissinger: Could your mother play the piano?
BLOCH: I think she knew something about it.

Bissinger: Did she sing?
BLOCH: No, she didn’t sing, but she loved music.

Bissinger: What were your father’s outside interests?
BLOCH: He was always interested in charities. He would give a tremendous amount to the Jewish Welfare in later years, not so much in his early years because he worked very hard. He used to play poker. He liked poker.

Bissinger: Where did he play poker?
BLOCH: I think it was at the Van Ryan up in Portland. I don’t think he played it down here. But in Portland, in those days, he belonged to a poker game.

Bissinger: Did he exercise, or did he take walks or anything?
BLOCH: No, he never did that too much. He used to come up weekends at Tahoe. He was always a very hard worker, that was his pleasure, but he liked to go out. He loved people, and people loved him. To this day, there are many people who talk about him. He was fun. He loved to have fun. Come upstairs.